Update:Wrong radio frequency not true – Marine commander
Some Marine officers dispute report on radio snafu
Wrong frequencies prevented aerial bombing, strafing
by Victor Reyes
Armed Forces chief Gen. Hermogenes Esperon Jr. has ordered a probe on the radio communications snafu that prevented bombing and strafing measures to aid a Marines contingent ambushed by secessionists in Al-Barka town, Basilan last July 10.
Fourteen Marines were killed, with 10 of them beheaded after the encounter.
AFP information chief Lt. Col. Bartolome Bacarro said the probe would look into the administrative liability of the personnel involved in the snafu.
Bacarro said among those to be probed are Lt. Col. Felix Almadrones and Maj. Nestor Marcelino, the relieved commanding officer and operations officer of the 8th Marine Battalion Landing Team.
He said the officer who relayed the wrong frequency to the Western Mindanao Command (WestMinCom) has been identified. He refused to name the officer.
The Marine inspector general’s office was tasked to investigate the incident on the recommendation of a military fact-finding body headed by AFP inspector general Maj. Gen. Ferdinand Bocobo.
Bacarro confirmed reports that the 1st Marine Brigade gave a wrong frequency to the WesMinCom, causing the failure of the aircraft to provide air support to the beleaguered troops.
Bacarro said the Huey, an MG-250 helicopter and an OV-10 plane failed to deliver firepower due to lack of communication between pilots and ground commanders.
Bacarro said the Huey helicopter was mounted with machineguns while the MG-250 attack helicopter was equipped with machineguns and rockets. OV-10 planes are capable of dropping bombs.
He said the aircraft used alternate or secondary frequency while soldiers on the ground used the primary frequency.
The aircraft supposedly hovered over the encounter site for at least three hours before returning to Zamboanga City, home of the WestMinCom.
Asked why the soldiers or pilots did not change frequency as they were not able to make contact, Bacarro said: “You should operate on the primary only unless there is coordination for both to shift to alternate frequency.”
Marines Inspector General eyes raps for Basilan radio fiasco
By Joel Guinto
Inquirer.net
The Inspector General of the Philippine Marines is studying what charges — criminal or administrative — may be filed against those responsible for the “miscommunication” during the July 10 clash in Basilan that left 14 Marines dead, a military spokesman said.
Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP) spokesman, Lieutenant Colonel Bartolome Bacarro, confirmed a report in the Philippine Daily Inquirer, parent company of INQUIRER.net, and Malaya newspaper that an inquiry led by AFP Inspector General, Major General Ferdinand Bocobo, found out that the 1st Marine Battalion headquarters in Basilan sent out the wrong radio frequency supposed to be used by air support UNITS from the Western Mindanao Command (Westmincom) base in Zamboanga City in communication with the troops on the ground in Al-Barkah town.
“There was some miscommunication on the [radio] frequency. This was recognized and the IG [Inspector General] recommended to the chief of staff to order the Philippine Marines to investigate some of the administrative liabilities,” Bacarro said.
The air reinforcements tried to contact the beleaguered Marines on a secondary frequency when the troops on the ground were operating on the primary frequency.
Under military rules, Bacarro said one of two units communicating with each other cannot switch radio frequencies without the concurrence of the other.
Thus, the UH-1H and MG520 attack helicopters, and OV-10 bomber plane that had come to the Marines’ assistance could not open fire, Bacarro told reporters in Camp Aguinaldo.
Bacarro said it was important for the air support to contact the Marines to determine exactly where to fire since the airmen could not see the troops on the ground because of the thick forest cover.
Asked if the investigation would lead to possible court martial, Bacarro said: “It could be subject to criminal and administrative liability. There are also criminal liabilities.”
However, Bacarro could not say whether the air support would have been sufficient to turn the tide of battle. “I would say that an air component is an integral part of the operation. [If it was crucial] in this operation, I cannot say,” he said.
Of the 14 Marines slain in the seven-hour battle, 10 were later found beheaded.
Bacarro said the soldier who sent the wrong radio frequency to Westmincom has been identified, but there has been no word on whether or not he has been relieved from his post.
Earlier, the ground commander of the embattled Basilan troops, Major Nestor Marcelino, and his battalion commander, Lieutenant Colonel Felix Almadrones, were relieved from the Marine Battalion Landing Team 8 due to “command responsibility” and to give way to the IG inquiry.
The Moro Islamic Liberation Front (MILF) has owned up to attacking the Marines, who the rebels accused of encroaching on their territory in Ginanta village. But the rebels have denied beheading the slain troops.
An investigation by the Coordinating Committee on the Cessation of Hostilities (CCCH), jointly chaired by the government and the MILF, concluded that at least four Abu Sayyaf bandits beheaded four of the 10 decapitated Marines.
But while it blamed the al Qaeda-linked extremists for the beheadings, the CCCH could not explain why Abu Sayyaf fighters were at the encounter site, a supposed MILF stronghold.
Bacarro said the Bocobo panel did not seek to determine who was behind the beheadings.
On Thursday, joint police and military forces set out to arrest some 130 suspects in the July 10 incident.
From a military officer:
It’s so sad that a lowly sergeant would again be blamed for the bungled radio frequency. It is the commanders’ responsibility to check and countercheck this operational requirment. Four hours is too long for commander not to do anything.
“But while it blamed the al Qaeda-linked extremists for the beheadings, the CCCH could not explain why Abu Sayyaf fighters were at the encounter site, a supposed MILF stronghold.”
Ate Ellen,
Yan nga ang malaking tanong. Bakit may mga grupong nakakakilos ng malaya sa sinasabing teritoryo ng MILF? Unless of course they are also part of the group. Kung sinasabi ng MILF na umalis sila after ng encounter, ibig sabihin ay talagang “ambush” ang nangyari. Kalokohan, dahil laging may bantay ang teritoryo. Pinaglololoko tayo ng mga MILF/MNLF/Sayaaf/Akbar/JI o anumang pangalan ng terror group na ito! Kasapakat ang mga corrupt at inept na military leaders!
It is so sad indeed that kung mababa ang rangko mayroon command responsibility..hindi ba dapat hanggang sa pinakamataas- ang presidente ng bayan (elected or not) ay mas ang responsibility?
Niñez Cacho-Olivarez’ column:
Read the whole column in http://www.tribune.net.ph/commentary/20070804com2.html
Just logged and read the last part of Ninez Olivarez’ “they were running out of fuel. So couldn’t the pilots then have refueled and gone back? Bakit nga naman hindi sila nagpa gasolina, full tank at muling bumalik sa lugar ng labanan?
Our assumptions o kathang isip:
1. Wala na ring gasolina sa hq, wala pang delivery.
2. Paglanding ng aircraft, nagka flat-tire, walang maipalit na reserba.
3. Hapon na noon, at ipalagay na may gasolina, naka-time out na yong incharge magkarga ng gasolina.
4. Useless na rin kung babalik, madilim na ang kalangitan, hindi na makikita kung sino ang papuputukan.
5. Dahil wrong frequency ang radio, wala na ring kontak ang piloto what’s happening in the ground.
Why doesn’t this Esperon resign and take responsibility for all this fiasco? His son, who is a scholar in Japan, should tell him how they do it in Japan when something tragic like this happens in Japan due to the incompetence, negligence, and worse, graft and corruption. The son should tell his father to resign and save his face by committing suicide even just to appease the souls of the victims of this kind of atrocities because of poor leadership by a criminal who should have been
in fact in jail by now.
Ang dami namang tsetseburetse. Limang oras naglalabanan, hindi pa nakapagpadala ng back-up. Why? Bakit hindi ipinadala sa Basilan iyong mga ipinadala ni Unano halimbawa sa Baseco, etc. para sa mga kalokohan niya. 5 oras na nakikipaglaban ang mga napugutan na hindi man lamang tinulungan ni Abu what’s his name governor ng Basilan na naghambug pang siya ang Basilan. Ano iyan?
Ano sisisihin pa iyong nasawing radioman? Ang dapat na patawan din ng sisi diyan ay iyong governor, etc. ng Basilan for not taking care of the peace and order in his province. Hindi komo may AFP soldiers ay dapat nang makalibre ang mga local policemen sa Basilan na ang local insurgencies dapat ay nasa ilalim ng pulisya dahil wala namang prueba na may foreign army na involved sa labanang iyan kundi mga tulisan lang. Puro kasi kabulastugan ang ginagawa kaya hindi na tumino ang bansa. Ang bobo naman!
Yuko, hindi naman nasawi ang radioman.
TP: 4. Useless na rin kung babalik, madilim na ang kalangitan, hindi na makikita kung sino ang papuputukan.
******
Oh yeah? But I thought the idiot has procured new and modern gadgets for the military as she has bragged like those reconnaissance planes with nighteyes that enable pilots to see the enemies even at night that the Americans use to kill Iraqis in Iraq. Lots of BS. Why don’t Esperon and the Unano at the palace by the murky river just quit and take responsibility for the death of these soldiers due to their incompetence, neglect, graft and corruption? Sobra na, tama na. Patalsikin Na, Now Na!
Sorry, Ellen, I thought he died because the woman leader of the battalion talked about him. Is that why he is now being blamed for the fiasco caused by bad leadership? Kawawa naman.
Maybe they have more than one radioman.
A radioman’s affidavit is one of the basis of this report.
Iyan na nga e, lowly sargeant naman ang bini-blame nila for the bungled radio frequency. Nakakaiyak na sa galit ito a! Can’t they do better than blaming this poor soldier.
Aba, sila naman ang umako ng mistakes, palagi na lang nagtatago sa pantalon/saya ng mga lowly soldiers ang kambal-tuko na commander-in-cheat gloria at cheat-of-staff asspweron at minions!
“It’s so sad that a lowly sergeant would again be blamed for the bungled radio frequency.”
Yes. But what’s new? I don’t believe you to be so naive as to believe commanders would willingly submit themselves to the stake (so to speak) it’s called self-preservation. it’s human nature. It’s like believing Gloria will ever step down. it’s an illusion. tagalog – ilusyon. You’re all being led around in wild goose chases. being fed info by the same enemy you hate. it’s called wasting your energy and running you down, so that you really dnt have anything left to what really matters. it doesn’t matter who they blame. why give credence to it by allowing yourself to be used as mouthpieces? what matters is we know whom to take to task for it.
The huge blunder of the AFP with the useless death of the 14 marines must be covered up with something! The hot shot tiayanak and asspweron are always RIGHT! The poor lieutenant and sargeant will have to be the escapegoats. These twin evil will never be able to run after the mutilators, afterall, these murderers are somehow connected to the political hot shots! They are the “men” of tiyanak’s election operators! For all we know, the murderers are now out of the country. These villains are nomads! How can a bunch of policemen track these people down? I even doubt that warriors in their right mind ( if they have any) will surrender to the authorities. Puro palabas lang yan! Then they will put those who surrender in jail and then a few months later, they jail break and they are back in business! How many of these so-called terrorist broke out of prison? There is a hand manipulating all of these!
The Abus and the MILFs are in the political payroll of whoever are in power. They will not be dismantled because they come in handy come election time and when funds are needed for the terrorism drive kuno. Who will dole out funds to Mindanao if it is peaceful? Di walang delihensiya si tiyanak, asspweron , akbar atbp. These lawless warriors are private armies of rotten politicians and warlords! They are not residents of Mindanao. They may just be recruits from all over! Their main job is to follow orders! Along the way, a lot of lives are sacrificed but those who pay these warriors big will never care! All they care about is to stay in their stolen thones!
With your kind indulgence, a bit off topic. Here’s the lates about Gonzalez:
DOJ chief treated in hospital for ulcer
Justice Secretary Raul M. Gonzalez was confined in a hospital Friday for treatment of bleeding ulcers.
My comment: It’s not ulcer. It’s his kidney problem that’s becoming worse.
The report that the marines used wrong frequencies even made the rumblings inside the marines worse. They are portraying the marines as dumb and don’t know what are the protocols during a battle. The marines who really know what happened are saying that the pilots and the radioman in the battlefield were actually communicating. The pilots were actually given the coordinates of where the enemies are BUT some ORDERS came from ABOVE AND the pilots were ordered not to fire & go back to base. The pilots were forced to drop their bombs at the sea instead.
Is he joking? AFP chief Gen. Esperon Jr. has ordered a probe on the radio communications snafu. Take your pick: whitewash or cover-up or both. Esperon’s Moro-Moro probe has zero credibility. The military internal investigation is proven to be one-sided like the Mayuga Report. There was no closure in the AFP probe on ISAPF illegal wiretapping in the Hello Garci political scam. None of its findings have been made public. Conclusion: speak no evil, hear no evil and see no evil. It’s business as usual in the corrupt military leadership.
There were also rumours that the Peace Negotiating Committee was against the Air Supports hitting the MILF as it may be against the conditions of the peace process and they pilots were ordered so.. Nobody predicted that the encounter will results in the “Criminal and Gruesome Acts of Mutilations” and had these not happened it will be just another encounter with the Marines troops taking a bad beating, and that the Big Boys(Generals) and their Patron Goyang Macapagal could take and things will “move on” as usual… to perdition.
There are lots of loopholes in Baccaro’s palusot. In fact, there are no enemies on the ground at Tipo-Tipo fiasco. Based on ABR, the pilots cannot fire on MILF rebels because ‘officially’ they are friendly forces. It appears that ground commanders are confused like a baby with this type of unclear Arroyo government policy and put our soldiers in a harm’s way. Even the best trained AFP commando unit cannot fight the enemy effectively with both hands tied and sometimes blindfolded.
Refer: The after-battle report (ABR) also touched on why only six rounds of 105 howitzers were fired during the eight-hour firefight.
The explanation was “the cease-fire committee ordered soldiers not to fire because they were engaging the MILF, considered by the government as ‘friendly forces.’”
I agree with NCO’s observation that “If there was a radio snafu, why did this order to provide air support come about, even after four hours?”
Hmmnn, kung and dahilan nga naman ay palpak na radio bakit nakatanggap ng order makalipas ang maraming oras?
Makakalbo sa kakaisip ang mga pinoy sa moro-morong ito!
Further to the sketchy unofficial report of the Basilan ambush, the link below belies the so-called radio miscommunications angle.
http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/storypage.aspx?StoryId=87047
PM members dispute report
Harion,
Kung wala kang sariling opinyon na makakatulong sa isyung ito ay huwag kang sumunod sa aking sinasabi. If I want to waste my energy on something you don’t want to read, wala kang pakialam! Don’t make your sermons here, bring it somewhere else!
Ellen, I’ll have my extended vacation. Nakakawalang gana ‘yang mga poste picking on thoughts of other bloggers for some reasons they only knew.
chi:
You now very well that bloggers come and bloggers go, where they go nobody is sure – but for sure you can never remember anything they said that made sense – smile
Harion Says: August 4th, 2007 at 12:23 am
“It’s so sad that a lowly sergeant would again be blamed for the bungled radio frequency.”
Yes. But what’s new? I don’t believe you to be so naive as to believe commanders would willingly submit themselves to the stake (so to speak) it’s called self-preservation. it’s human nature.
Harion, read Ellen’s post again, this was her repeat of a quote from a ‘military officer’ not one of the bloggers here.
Haemorrhoid Assperon seems to be oblivious to the fact that everyone and his uncle, including the marines themselves, knows very well that this massacre was the result of his insincere corrupt leadership and lack of command responsibilty. It could be seen as dividing the marines even more than he has already done to them.
This Marine officers probe could backfire in being the last straw that breaks the camels back, for the Marine Corp.
Its his call!
WWNL,
It’s not my quote, I just followed the trend of thought of the military officer. We have already been through a lot of bloggers picking on thoughts of others that ended up on useless DADA. And instead of discussing the issue, they go on giving us sermons as if we are all bobos here.
Harion’s post was for all of us, not only directed to me. What’s his business if we allow ourselves to be “mouhtpieces” of persons we support?
Sorry, pero kapag maganda ang gising at ang nabasa mo ay ganito kay Harion advocating himself, even the blog suffers.
guys , good morning…..nakakagalit naman ang findings nila..paeang gusto ko ng ilabas lahat ang alam ko dito para mabasa ng lahat kung papaano may maniobra ang mga yan…plan c ba nila yan na kung mapalpak ang plan b nila yung mga walang kapangyarihan at may mababang rank na sundalo ang magdudusa…
sa amin pag tuwing gabi may spy plane na walang sawang umiikot at kahit walang opn pag gusto nilang mag ubos ng at ibagsak lahat ng klaseng bomba ibabagsak nila para makahingi ng funds sa amerika..
maling communication…maling frequency? Hello, bago sila pumunta sa OPN may briefing sila may reinforcement sila mula sa marine brigade sa sulu, ang talagang scenario sa amin kapag naglalaban ang militar at mnlf o milf bago magsimula ang bombahan, umaalis na ang mga kawawang civilian dala-dala ang mga gamit at magsisilikas dahil hindi sa mnlf o milf natatakot kundi sa mga militar at sa mga kasama nitong cvo dahil alam na kung ano ang mangyayari sa pagbobomba na ultimo bahay ng sibilyan na walang tao sinusunog nila.
saan kayo nakakita ng operation laban sa abu sayyaf nakakatawa nga dahil pag abu sayyaf di nila kayang mag bomba at imbis na bomba ang ibagsak pagkain para sa abu sayyaf.
heto na naman si almodranes…taga create ka ba talaga ng gulo sa amin?
sa aminin nyo at sa hindi di kapalpakan ng mga tao niyo yun ..yun ang iniutos nyo..at tuwing may opn na gagawin si General Esperon pumupunta para kausapin ang mga opisyales niya alam na agad namin taga dun na may gagawin sila….kaya nga di mahuli=huli yung mga sinasabi nyong indonesian eh, kaasi kahit di dun naka-assigned at sa ibang bansa naka-assigned bilang intelligence nandun sa kalingalang caluang may mga kasamang sundalo 150 at 200 na mga tao niya para hanapin ang mga lider di para patayin kasi may malaki daw na buyer, at sino yung malaking buyer? malakanyang?
don’t fool us…di ako nagsasalita ng exagerated dito dahil kahit natutulog ako at tanungin nyo ko sasagutin ko ng buong-buo…yung mga sundalo nakakaawa, sa reward mga nakatakip ang mukha niyo dahil makikilala kayo na tauhan ng mga matataas ang ranggo…
pinagyayabang nyo pa nga yung bigay na bagong aparato ng america na debugger … mayron pang satellite cp, frequency magkaiba gagamitan..lumang tugtugin na yan dahil may gadget kayong ginagamit na pinahiram o bigay ng america na nakikita yung kalaban,
Gen.Bocobo isa lang masasabi ko sa binigay mong rason pinatunayan mo lang sa aming mga muslim na sa bawat operation niyo sa lugar namin habang nagbabarilan at nag momortar sa ibaba ang magkalaban mnlf o milf man at militar mayroon nasa taas na nagdidirect kung saan pupunta ang OV para magbagsak at nagtataboy sa abu sayyaf para humanap ng matataguan…
goji:
I was shocked to read that Justice Secretary Raul M. Gonzalez was confined in a hospital Friday for kidney treatment – I hope it’s serious – smile.
Gokusen, you just reinforced my belief. Talagang ang mga Abus at MILF ay katha lang ng mga nasa poder. Totoo na ang kawawa ay ang mga tunay na Muslim. I have some very good Muslim friends and they say the same thing. Mas nakakarami sa mga Muslim ang biktima kaysa sa bumibiktima. Kung susundan mo talaga ang yabag ng mga Abus at MILF, ang tanging destinasyon ay kay tiyanak at kay asspweron! Kawawang mga sundalo, nagagamit sila sa pagkagahaman ng mga nasa itaas!
It may be true that there really are Moslem terrorists but the so-called factions(Abus, MILF) are simply the hired gangsters of the warlords and those who want to hang on to a stolen powerful position!
ganyan ang AFP ng pilipinas. palaging maliliit na sundalo ang nasisisi. noong pinatay si ninoy, maliliit na sundalo ang ikinulong. may opisyal bang naparusahan? at saka nakatikim na ng kapangyarihan ang militar noong martial law. nalaman din nila na kaya nilang magpabagsak at magluklok at umalalay sa isang lider noong panahon ni cory at ngayon naman ay hawak nila sa leeg si gloria. ang maganda dito, may ‘check and balance’ din naman sa mga militar dahil faction- faction na sila. may kanya-kanyang gimik.
Ang mga alipores ni tiyanak ay iniisa isa nang nagkakasakit. Ito na kaya ang sinyales ng katapusan ng rehimeng tiyanak? Sana nga…smile!
Pointing fingers on a radioman is illogical. First we need to understand what is an infantry ,then we can sum-up who is responsible. Each company had its own captain who coordinated movements of the whole company. The platoons structures form a company and it is under by a LT.’s The squads compose by a platoons is under the Sgts. These squads would report to the platoon, and the platoon would report to the company. The company will report to the rear which is the battalion HQ.
The radioman on the squad would only spoke to a scrambled eggs voice so that the enemy troops on the same frequency could not know what are the message are. Codes were entered into the radio so to the speech could be only understood by the unit troops only and not the enemy. The main objective of the radioman would alert the men of an enemy attacks so that they can prepare by calling an increase of support .Being a radio operator he had to communicate with pilots and call in air strikes or call in air strike.
Every time a radio operator would call a pilot to land for something, they would throw a smoke canister down. The smoke allows the pilot to see which way the wind is blowing and to identify the correct target. The smoke was colored and the pilot would have to state the color of the smoke he was intending to land by before actually landing. The radio operator announces he is throwing the smoke, but will not state its color. That way if the color the pilot stated was wrong the radio operator could tell his that is the wrong target to land by. The radioman is the backbone in the battle and he need to be protected so that he can stay alive.
# we-will-never-learn Says:
August 4th, 2007 at 7:13 am
goji:
I was shocked to read that Justice Secretary Raul M. Gonzalez was confined in a hospital Friday for kidney treatment – I hope it’s serious – smile.
….I was also shocked that he’s still alive.
….I was also shocked that he’s still alive.
Thats funny – smile.
Gokusen: Thanks for the info. I had been to Sulu in 1968 as guest of a family and stayed there for two weeks..and I found the people to be nice- they keep a distance perhaps from “strangers” that we were..but they were ok. And it erased many of the myths that we were told about them as children. Our host’s father was a general from Iloilo and his mother was a dayang dayang. Ang akala ko naman na hindi mabombahan ang Sulu dahil we are all Filipinos. Ang akala ko naman in our military system..the officers take full responsibility of those in their command..I now realize how naive I am..I learned and am learning a lot of things here.
Chi: do you know kinaray-a? I pa translate of na lang…”hindi pagsabaka ang bata tiki.” bebe pa yon at hindi pato..kaya puro quack quack lang.
Correction: ipatranslate mo na lang.
yuko,
ang governor ng basilan Jum Akbar , asawa ng congressman.
Yung isang pa niyang asawa si Cherry Santos-Akbar, mayor ng isabela,basilan.
Yung isa pa niyang wife, si Nur-in Abbas Akbar, kumandidato sa Lamitan, Isabela . Kaso natalo kasi yun ang mahiyain sa tatlo
at first time na tumakbo sa pulitika.
Si Congressman Wahab Akbar ang dating governor ng basilan, nang si gerry salapuddin pa ang congressman. Tapos noong nakaraang eleksyon kumandidatong governor si gerry at nakalaban niya yung asawa ni Akbar.
Update ko pa sa yo meron na rin isang town na bago dun ang pangalan ay Akbar. kaya wag kang magtataka pagdating ng panahon na ang basilan ay palitan na rin ng province of akbar..
rose,
there are different muslim tribes in mindanao, if born and raise sa sulu, tausug, kasabihan nga ng mga muslim yun ang matatapang na muslim fighter kung tawagin..pero mga sensitive na tao and mostly mnlf are tausugs, yet the milf started in mainland but they have their camps in basilan.
majority doesnt know how to speak tagalog and much more other languages so they are very much aloof but they will treat you nicely there are so many illiterates because of the non-stop war or feud of different families. those influential and affluent families are the one who grab the politics to maintain power in the province together with their guns and gang they will be in position
goji;
Raul Gonzales is alive,know what? his you know what is dead.A lonely night for his wife,the scratcher is dysfunctional.
Gokusen: thanks. kasi very negative ang concept ko sa mga Moro noon..laging panakot sa amin ng mga takakatanda.. :may mora diyan..nanghuhuli ng mga bata na sutil.” But I was told now that in Antique there are many Muslim settlements and their children co-mingle with other kids…The war etc. is only contained or affect the Mindanao region..and not the entire country..kaya lang the adm. uses this rationale to get more money from the wealthier countries..she uses and manipulate people.. may evil steak ata.
Re-Raul Gonzales..Kaya hindi pa namamatay kasi binibigyan ng Dios na magsisi siya..but I am sure physically naghihirap siya..bayad lang yan sa mga pinahirapan niya. And besides marami siyang pera hindi ba sabi niya sa poultry business lang ng asawa niya chicken feed. And what about monkey business? Hayaan natin maubos ang pera nila sa pagpagamot..habang buhay ba siya mas malaki ang gastos..total kung hindi mapurify ang kaluluwa niya hindi naman madadala ang pera at kung madala man baka masunog lang naman..kaya ayaan na lang makinabang ang hospital habang siya ay physically inutil sa lahat ng bagay..sabi nga ni Cocoy dysfunctional na..ang utak matagal ng dysfunctional hindi ba? Ang dasal ko? Lord give him more years to live in the hospital..
rose,
real muslims are very much afraid of allah, yung jihad is very sacred, once namatay sa war mojahedeen kaya di sila umaatras sa laban at ang pamilya ng mga mojahedeen di yun iiyak o magsisi kasi alam nila kabanalan ang ginawa. at kung saan namatay dun din inililibing.
pag may labanan ang militar at ang mga muslim, ang militar nagtatago kasi alam nila ang mga muslim pasugod sa bala at habang sinasalubong ang bala ng kalaban patuloy bumabaril.
kaso nga, ang mga ibang may masamang utak ginagamit ang jihad sa maling paraan..tulad ng mga teroristang muslim….kaya totoo na kawawa ang militar kasi mas marami ang namamatay sa laban kaysa muslim kasi nga ang mga pinadadalang reinforcement di nila alam kung papano ang tactic ng mga muslim lalo na sa gabi kaya ang ginagawa ng govt news blackout..
Gokusen;
I have a moslem friend and I read the Quoran he gave me and my deep understanding of the Islam religion enlighten my belief to remain Christian. I come to know about the history of Muhammed whom they proclaimed the messenger and prophet of Allah after Christ. I agree with your prospectives about Jihadist virtual culture. Jihadist virtual culture speaks volumes about the current state of this global movement, its evolving ideology, emerging tendencies, and, finally, the vision of the future its adherents would like to impose on those around them.
In Their Holy Quaran I read something about like This; The three basic tenets are the belief that the Quoran, transmitted utterances of the Prophet,a willingness to denounce as apostates, and even kill, Muslims who fail to profess Islam as jihadist feel it should be professed and a commitment to jihad, understood as warfare, not only as the only legitimate and effective means of “making God’s word supreme,” but also as the crux and apex of Islam itself. The Arabic term jihad, usually translated into European languages as holy war. Jihad came to mean the defence of the Islamic world, from invasion and intrusion by non-Islamic forces.
Rose;
Nasaan na si Harion,nagkatampuhan na naman ba sila ni Chi;
Wala ng tampuhan,igalang na lang natin ang kanilang mga opinyon kung iyon ang gusto nila,di ba?
cocoy,
very well said…kaya nga ang mga moslem terrorists ngayun ginagamit yung “tablig” nagtatago sila sa likod nito para magpalaganap ng terorismo..
gokusen;
Thank you,Know what my friend,I read the whole book of Quaran and I did some researched regarding the lives and history of Muhammed,I am glad you come here at Ellenville and maybe,we can discuss more if that topic arise.
gokusen;
The messenger is an impostor.
The sources said the pilot, Capt. Ferdinand Liwag of the 9th Tactical Operations Group, made contact with the commanding officer of MBLT 8 Lt. Col. Almadrones and the radio man on the ground. The pilot was given grid coordinates of the area where the enemies were.
Shortly after, two MG520s arrived on the scene. The three aircrafts hovered and circled the area but reportedly left without firing a single shot and without dropping a bomb. The OV10 was reportedly forced to drop its bombs at sea.
…The sources said they want a deeper probe on what really happened to find out who recalled the helicopters that could have saved lives.
They also expressed dismay over the results of the joint government-MILF probe into the Basilan encounter. Instead of narrowing the list, the sources said, the investigating body should have even added names to the list….”
i share with the sentiments of the soldiers in the field…hmmm the investigations done only in wesmin , zamboanga and not in basilan, which always happened everytime they conduct investigations…they will dictate what to say to the affiants in lieu with their own plan, ,majority in those 130 accused are innocent which is not political ally of the local politicians. those military whether based in basilan or reinforcement doesn’t know the names of those people except the local politicians who has much influenced in the place and the people around them they will give their own civilian witnesses and fabricate the informations, that’s why the legitimate people who knows the real scenario are excluded. those are being instigated by the intelligence force based in zamboanga who doesnt been in basilan and then they will give the recommendation for the filing of cases against those accused. and all their affidavits are marked “secret” and cannot be open to the public. Only the lawyers of the accused could have the chance to asked for certified copies for them to release information, but the saddest point is that those accused are penniless and majority are illiterate, they can’t hire lawyers who could defend them and the result they will go up to the mountains and hide and they will never give themselves spots to prove they are innocents…
cocoy,
thanks, i’m open into it!
Cocoy: I am a Peanuts fan kaya to borrow Charlie Brown’s one liner-“they are entitled to their own wrong opinion.” ang sasabihin ko sana kay Chi to borrow the American slang “pay him no mind..he is a kid” Naku! Nagagaya na ata ako kay panggulo sa Pilipinas puro utang.. puro utang.
May itatanong sana ako sa either one of you Cocoy or gokusen: way back when in the early 60’s (I guess before you two were born) there were news about a military training camp “Jabidah” ata ang pangalan to train soldiers-selected ones to prepare them for war against nvasion.that was the time when ownership of Sabah was in question…and I think the training place was in Corregidor..May nangyari ba sa training na iyon? Was that also the time of Diosdado?
We used to read newspapers kasi mayroon kaming subject na current events…
rose,
di pa nga ako pinapanganak niyan pero sabi ng mga ninuno ko totoo yun, ang malinaw lang sa akin yung jabidah massacre kasi yun ang 14 na muslim youth ang pinatay sa corregidor during marcos time. at mag 40 yrs na dun nagsimula ang pagtatag ng MNLF.
yun ang alam ko, pero yung simula ng pagtraining na sa panahon pa ni diosdado..di ko sigurado
Everyone, my bad if I assumed that it was Ellen who said it. But that doesn’t change the fact that whoever said it is too naive. Chi, you misinterpreted me. i didn’t mean you were being mouthpieces for those whom you support. perhaps it would be clearer if you read my post agn. then maybe you’d understand i was saying the opposite. that it was the enemy you’ve become mouthpieces for by discussing info supplied by them. you’re legitimizing it and making it out as if it is valid enough to be discussed. and unless i am mistaken, all of you are for liberty. in a democracy, you have no right to tell me what not to do. it’s called freedom. unless my actions (or words) bring harm to people, i am free to do or say anything i want. in the same vein, u have that same right. if ur blood pressure rises at the views i present, u have the choice not to read them the moment u see my name pop up. anyway, me nag warning sakin d2 na dapat daw malakas puso ko para mag participate dito. eh tingin ko di yata sakin dapat sinasabi yan.
oh and i forgot, apologies to Ellen for misquoting you
Was it Pres. Quezon who said that “your freedom ends where my nose begins?”
radio communication, wrong frequency, chopper’s fuel shortage whatever it is, I will not come to believe on it, all these are just diversionary tactics and scapegoat by both gloria and essperon in the killing of our soldiers in basilan.
investigation ! investigation ! probe ! probe ! ganyan nalang yan hanggat andyan sila gloria at essperon.
Rose;
Kung early 60’s,ang bisikleta ko ng panahon na iyon ay tatlong gulong.Iyong gulong sa unahan ay kasing laki ng bandihado at iyong dalawang gulong naman sa likod ay kasing laki ng platito.Binabasahan ako ng lola ko ng libro,ang natatandaan ko ay “Pepe at Pilar”.Iyong lolo ko ay mahilig namang manood ng “Buhay Artista” sa black and white TV na dalawang tubo ng bomba ang pinagdugtong na ginawang antenna sa itaas ng bubong.Pag narinig ko na ang kililing ni Apyong nanghihingi na ako ng singko kay lolo pambili ng sorbetes.Ang unang memorial event na natandaan ko at hangga ngayon ay hindi ko malimutan,ay yong Times magazine na binabasa ni Lolo at galit na sinabi sa akin na ang topic ay binaril ni Haevey Oswald si JFK sa Dallas Texas.Kaya hindi ko siguro alam “Jabida Massacre” Pero alam ko ng nilusob ng mga “Lapiang Malaya” ang Malacanang na ang pinuno nila ay si Valentin Delos Santos.May anting-anting daw siya at hindi siya tinatablan ng bala.
I would be willing to donate walkie-talkie to the
AFP kung sira-sira naman pala ang radio nila kaya lang kung para sa administration ng isang kriminal, huwag na! Baka pa i-hoard ng ungas gaya ng ginagawa doon sa mga bigas na ibinibigay ng US para sa mga mahirap na nabulgar noong 2002 na hino-hoard ni Unano sa Batangas hanggang sa inamag at hindi na nila maibenta ng mahal. Iyon na lang dapat may mga nakulong na, pero walang nangyari sa expose na ginawa ng mga responsible media.
Nakakaawa talaga ang situation ng mga tao sa Pilipinas. No wonder that a friend of mine in the media in the Philippines has decided that he would just write for publicity of the highest bidder. He told me, “Ayokong magutom, Yuko!” Taragis talaga! Kakai-Yuck talaga!
Sobra na, tama na! Patalsikin Na, Now Na!
AK-47: radio communication, wrong frequency, chopper’s fuel shortage whatever it is, I will not come to believe on it, all these are just diversionary tactics and scapegoat by both gloria and essperon in the killing of our soldiers in basilan.
*****
Sinabi mo pa. Ang daming katwiran! Hindi na lang bumaba and the crooks take full responsibility, legal and otherwise, for the crimes that they are committing against their own people. Dapat diyan kay Espero, sinisibak, at iyong kriminal at the palace by the murky river, dapat kinukulong! Tanong: How many more Filipinos do they need to sacrifice to make the position of the creep permanent? Ang saya niya! Sabi nga sa Bible, “They deserve what they get.”
cocoy,
la lang natawa ako sa wento mo…kasi di ko inabutan yun eh, pero pag tungkol sa latest ng mindanao mula magkamalay ako kahit natutulog ako babangutin pa ko…isa lang sasabihin wawa naman kami…huli sa lahat…
—-
saka alam ko di naman kinakailangang maging magaling o fluent sa english para di tamaan ng bomba at mortar, kailangan magaling kang tumakbo at humanap ng taguan
gokusen,
‘yan ang pinakamainam na katwiran. ang maling tunog ng pagsasalita ng inggles ay hindi nakamamatay paris ng impact ng bombang sasabog sa iyong harapan.
Gokusen: saka alam ko di naman kinakailangang maging magaling o fluent sa english para di tamaan ng bomba at mortar, kailangan magaling kang tumakbo at humanap ng taguan
******
Sinabi mo pa Gokusen. Sa Japan nga, Japanese lang ang gamit pati ng mga sundalo at pulis, pero efficient. Wala pa akong nabalitaang napugutan ng ulo na sundalo o pulis sa isang mahigpit na labanan sa mga yakuza, hoodlums, etc. sa Japan.
Kahit sa pakikipagbarilan sa mga Yakuza, pulis lang ang lumalaban at humuhuli sa mga kriminal. Hindi tumatawag ng mga sundalo kasi well-prepared at well-trained ang mga pulis namin. May mga bomb experts pa nga kahit na hindi graduate ng kung anong military school diyan.
Separate nga ang military at police academies namin e. Alam nilang may kani-kaniya silang tungkulin pero isa lang ang kanilang layunin, ang kapakanan ng bansa at taumbayan hindi gaya sa Pilipinas na kapakanan pa ng isang kriminal ang main objective! Yuck!
ystakei, wala ! para na tayong bola na pinapaikot lang ! and justice is just watching !
mukhang napakatahamik yata ang congresso at senado sa mga nangyayari ngayon? wala na ba sila magawa?
Maliban kay Senator Trillanes, AK-47, wala na akong tiwala doon sa ibang GO candidates. Sabi nga, “Once bitten, twice shy!” Ganyan ang karamihan sa amin sa Japan sa totoo lang. Minsan masira, magpakamatay na lang ang katwiran namin. Sana ganyan din sa Pilipinas! 😛
ystakei, kung may gusto man tumulong kay AT4 sa senado? malamang si honassan lang ang pwedeng kumausap ngayon kay gloria.
ak-47, pupusta ako, mas gugustuhin pa ni trillanes na makipagbuno sa korte kaysa humingi o tumanggap ng tulong mula sa mga TRAYDOR AT WALANG PANININDIGANG TAO!
naku kasi ang nasa senado iba jan, at nasa malakanyang di pa nila naranasan bagsakan ng bomba, pero kami ultimo batang paslit alam na na pag dumaan ang spy plane mga ilang oras na may babagsak ng bomba ang OV…
yung isang sundalo na nabagsakan sa harapan niya ng mortar na ginamit ng mnlf nung nakuha na nila ang camp bitanag sa panamao, na shock dun sa barko byaheng zamboanga nagkuwento siya, ayaw na daw niya bumalik sa sulu kasi ang galing daw mag mortar ng mga kalaban nila lahat pasok sa campo walang mintis…
Sinabi mo pa, Magno. Gloria listens to Honasan? Sa panaginip!
Maliban na lang kung type niya si Honasan na maging lalaki din niya! Baligtad pa ngayon ang labas ni Honasan. Imbes na siya ang nagkakabit, siya na ngayon ang kakabitin. Yuck! Wala namang taste!
But you’re right. Senator Trillanes has more sense than ask Honasan for help to talk to the creep. Para na rin siyang nakipag-deal sa demonyo kapag ginawa niya iyon.
It appears that the intervention of OIC Defense Chief Norberto Gonzales in the Tipo-Tipo fiasco may have prevented military ground commanders from pursuing Moro rebels after the firefight. Politicians should not intervene in military operations. Radio snafu is a flimsy excuse.
Excerpts from Daily Tribune: “They (officers) said if not because of him (Gonzales), our men could have already pursued the enemies right from that incident in Tipo-Tipo. But he intervened. He paraded himself in Basilan, talked to the local government units there, governors, other civilians including the MILF or members of the CCCH (Ceasefire Committee on the Cessation of Hostilities). He should get out from the DND (Department of National Defense). He may be good in another Cabinet post but not in the DND,” the Yes Arms spokesman said.
“He (Gonzales) is creating too much furor already within the AFP, (causing) more dissension on the part of our soldiers. They (Malacañang) are making our soldiers look stupid when these people are more intelligent than their leaders who show no leadership,” Aparri said.
He added the soldiers who survived the Al-Barka clash “feel that they are being sacrificed by this government for an objective that they don’t know.”
DKG,
totoo isa si norberto gonzales na makikialam niyan, at talagang walang alam ang sundalo, kasi sunod lang sila ng sunod sa order ng mga opisyales nila. at ang mga sundalo na pinapadala sa mga brigade sa sulu, basilan, tawi-tawi di briefing ng mga opisyales kung ano at sino ang kalaban, ang sa kanila basta may hawak na baril kalaban..sa lugar namin ultimo batang 8yrs marunong nang humawak ngg m14 di dahil mga rebelde kasi yun na ang kinagisnan ng mga tao sa amin di baleng walang makain pero kailangan may sakbit na baril sa katawan.
kasi si norberto gonzales ang isa sa likod ng pagkuha kay nur misuari, hinudas (sorry for the word) niya ang mga tausug na siyang nag-alaga sa kanya nung siya ay may political problem, sa katunayan pumasok pa yan sa mnlf, at ng makuha niya ang tiwala ng mnlf, tumakas yan ng bansa papuntang malaysia dahil may mnlf camp din dun at yung mga taong nagtiwala at nag-alaga sa kanya ang inahas niya pagbalik niya sa gobyerno…
mrivera, malay natin baka taktika lang din ni honassan yong pakikipag deal nya kay gloria ! kasi utakan ngayon di ba?
ak-47,
taktika? ewan. wala na akong sampalataya sa kanya mula nang talikuran niya ang simulaing aming ipinaglalaban.
para sa bayan? noon ‘yun.
ngayon ang sa kanya, para sa bayad.
mrivera, malay mo yong loan ni honassan kay gloria, capital nalang ang babayaran nya! yong interest wala na ! hahaha…
serious na tayo, wag mawalan ng pag-asa kasi sabi ko naman sayo na utakan “bottle of the brain” na ang nangyayari, matira ang may pinaka-makamandag ngayon ! si gloria palagay ko ultimo singaw noon pag inihipan ka bulagta ka kaagad sa tindi ng kamandag nya.
gokusen, simulat simula duda na talaga ako kay norberto gonzales na yan, sa lahat na mga binibitawan nyang salita kumukulo ang dugo ko dahil wala kang maramdaman na katutuhanan sa mga sinasabi nya.