Justice Secretary Raul Gonzales said that the Philippines might seek custody of the American servicemen accused of raping a Filipina last Nov. 1 in Olongapo within 20 days.
Five of the six Marines named in the complaint with the Olongapo Prosecutor’s Office (Keith Silkwood, Daniel Smith, Albert Lara, Dominic Duplantis, Corey Barris, and Chad Carpenter) are confined in the US Embassy. That’s because there’s a provision in the RP-US Visiting Forces Agreement that says: “Recognizing the responsibility of the United States military authorities to maintain good order and discipline among their forces, Philippine authorities will, upon request by the United States, waive their primary right to exercise jurisdiction except in cases of particular importance to the Philippines.
“If the Government of the Philippines determines that the case is of particular importance, it shall communicate such determination to the United States authorities within twenty (20) days after the Philippine authorities receive the United States request.”
During the negotiations of the VFA in 1996, the Americans expressed concern over the appalling conditions in our jails. Philippine authorities could only agree. That’s the reason behind the waiving of our primary right to exercise jurisdiction over the accused.
The Nov. 1 rape case, the first since the VFA was signed in 1998, is a test for the treaty which governs the status of US personnel in the Philippines whenever they are here for joint training exercises, consultations, exchanges and other activities in pursuance of the 1951 Mutual Defense Treaty.
There are now calls for the review of the VFA. Understandably, the militant left has renewed their call for the abrogation of the accord, which was negotiated during the Ramos administration and ratified by the Senate during the first year of the Estrada administration.
Without the VFA, however, a weak Philippine government would not have a basis to assert its jurisdiction if the US decides to bring out the accused as what happened in a number of cases during the US military bases years.
Under the criminal jurisdiction provision of the VFA, offenses by US personnel within Philippine territory fall under three types of jurisdiction: Philippine, US and both Philippines and US.
Rape and murder fall under Philippine jurisdiction because these crimes will never be considered as acts done in the performance of official duty, a situation where US military authorities could request for jurisdiction over the accused.
Another relevant provision of the VFA on custody of the accused is that the custody of any United States personnel over whom the Philippines is to exercise jurisdiction shall immediately reside with the United States military authorities, if they so request, from the commission of the offense until completion of all judicial proceedings.
“United States military authorities shall, upon formal notification by the Philippine authorities and without delay, make such personnel available to those authorities in time for any investigative or judicial proceedings relating to the offense with which the person is charged.
“In extraordinary cases, the Philippine government shall present its position to the United States Government regarding custody, which the United States Government shall take into full account.
“In the event Philippine judicial proceedings are not completed within one year, the United States shall be relieved of any obligations under this paragraph.”
VFA provisions may seem to be kind to US personnel, but the Philippine government can protect its aggrieved citizen it wants to.
I seriously doubt if the Americans will agree to turn over their citizens under Philippine jurisdiction. And I also seriously doubt if the Arroyo government, which is groveling for US support, will have the courage to assert the country’s “primary right” over the accused.
Last week, some newspapers carried a news item of Justice Undersecretary Ernesto Pineda’s meeting with Senator Richard Lugar (R., Indiana) in Washington D.C.
Apparently the meeting was arranged by Venable LLP, the American public relations firm hired by national security adviser Norberto Gonzales to lobby for American intervention in the drafting of the Philippine Constitution, because Pineda was accompanied by former US Senator Birch Bayh.
Bayh is a partner in Venable LLP.
The news reports said Lugar assured Pineda that “the US will not back any attempt to topple Arroyo.”
Did he expect Lugar to say otherwise? If a justice undersecretary can get excited over such shallow remark by a US senator, how can they be expected to insist for jurisdiction in this rape case?
E-mail from Don Winters:
Pretty hard to rape a prostitute.Just another way of extortion. $500 and a visa to the U.S. will probably settle the case.
Your view is deplorable.
I bet those Americans will never spend even a night in a Philippine jail.
And to Don Winters, I paid your mother and your sister $10 each
Discrimination is a part of your History. I won’t be surprised why people like you who is uncivilized and uncultured make such comments to a Filipina who was victimized by one of your own. Hey! dude how many hookers can you get for $500 ? 1,2,3 or even more, that is the true color of a dollar bill.
Manuel,
A foreign affairs officer actually offered me a bet. He said the Arroyo government will be able to get jurisdiction over the American soldiers and they will be put in Muntinlupa. I said, I’m eager to be surpised. I promised to treat him to lunch if I’m proven wrong.
Ellen,
I submit that conditions in Philippine jails are more appalling than other western jails. But hey, the Philippines weren’t coerced into signing the lopsided “custody” provisions. The Americans wanted the VFA badly – the Philippines had a kind of “the upper hand” then; the U.S. needed the Philippines to jumpstart their fight against muslim fundamentalists located somewhere just below Equator.
If the Philippines thought that they were getting a huge slice in cash or in goods of the U.S. FMF (Foreign Military Funding), they were wrong – I said so to Erap himself and to a lot of the military big shots and a few politicians I was discussing with at the time. I explicitly told them that there would be no cash involved – U.S. FMF destined for the Philippines would come by way of training, schooling, mercy missions but not in cash nor in hardware – they wouldn’t believe me. They realize that now.
The VFA was negotiated at full speed during the Ramos administration but the final draft was accepted and signed by Estrada. The nation’s leaders at the time were very shortsighted. Let’s hope they won’t be shortsighted today.
It is very likely that Gloria will use the current rape issue to boost her “political standing” with Bush. In other words, like it or not, the victim is now incidental. The unfortunate future scenario that the victim will have been screwed twice.
The better tactic would be to require that the 5 accused face U.S. military court martial in the Philippines (this can be done) and if they are proven guilty, could serve their sentence in US military prisons (which can be very, very tough on their inmates). This is the only way for both nations to come to a win-win situation, sort of sign of good faith from both parties, so that the victim that is if she was truly raped would obtain justice.
The Philippines signed a very lopsided agreement. I do hope the nation’s leaders will have the balls today to tell the U.S. so without necessarily ruffling Washington. (Politics is politics!)
Regards.
If one knows “a part”, but does not know or understand how the “part” fits into the whole, i.e., picture – then the only valid (logical) conclusion is: “the part, taken out of context to which it properly belongs” cannot be properly (logically) understood.
This flaw in logic is rather common in “political punditry”…endemic in Op-Ed, analysis-paralysis. First, the facts. What are the verifiable, defensible facts?
I still have to read a full account of WHO WAS RAPED.HOW, WHERE, WHEN it happened. Nothing. Readily every journalist and OP-ED columnist – together with “anti-Americans and anti-Americanism” have jumped into and assumed the “judge, juror, executor”roles.
We are given the names of the (some say 5, others insist 6) rapists. Very few will remember their names except that they “is Americans; imagine of that – ANIM NA MALALAKING KANO, NILAPASTANGAN AT NIGAHASA ANG ISANG MALIIT NG PILIPINA…”
With this scant information about the incident, Philippine media and (politically motivated) readers alike have made all kinds of analyses.
What is there to analyze? The answers provided depend on how “politically motivated” the responder is. To exacerbate and further confuse the situation, nobody has come up with a clear, unequivocal and dependable explanation of WHAT LAWS ARE APPLICABLE IN THIS INCIDENT? Yet everybody who had written and responded with allusion to, or reference to THE VFA agreement/treaty, have assumed that “the fault (the trick, if nothing else) is to examine the provisions of the VFA.” That is what political reporting and analyese have become in the Philippines.
“Easy sell sensationalism”, I call it. If the news broke out as “6 men raped a Pilipina”, that would hardly make the third or fourth page of any broadsheet paper or prime time “nagaalab at nagbabagang” balita ng bayan. Believe that.
But why is it causing quite a bit of stir? Kasi ang “involved (daw)” ay mga “malalaki, malalakas, may mga dollars, na KANO na, MILITARY pa….” Has all the ingredients for…”Sobra na talaga ang mga Kano. Mga bully. Mangaapi. We are Pinoys. We have rights, you know? Hindi tama ito. Kailangan makabawi kami. Makaganti. Kung hindi, kasalanan ng Administrasyon ito. Kasi pumayag silang magpaloko noong pinasok nila ang bansa sa VFA, VFA na yan….so???? GLORIA MAGRESIGN KA NA!”
Next thing we know…this will be another isyu added to the campaign/movement to “oust Gloria from the OP”. In the meantime,the focus on “THE RAPE, and THE RAPED” will become faded and jaded….typical Pinoy judicial system…and judicial reporting. Ganoon talaga. Style Pinow. WOW!!!!
The facts are simple: INCOMPLETE. UNVERIFIED. UNCORROBORATED. Let’s get the facts out into the open first.
Let’s get the AUTHORITIES responsible and ACCOUNTABLE. And equally important, WHAT LAWS ARE APPLICABLE? (according to whom, and why shoud such be the case).
One of the most deplorable “happening” in the Pilipino way of thinking and analyzing (political situations) is the fact, that the Pinoy has become the victim of unrestrained brainwashing and mindsetting by Philippine media. BRAINWASHED.
Between a brainwashed – “literate” (but misinformed) members of Pilipino society on one hand, and the “hungry” -viz., and struggling to survive until the next meal” – it wouldn’t take much to bloviate, spin, plot, overtly, (much less)covertly, or even subliminally.
Rape in any language is a heinous crime. That is the first fact. Regardless of who did it. IT IS A FUCKING CRIME THAT CRIES TO HEAVEN FOR RETRIBUTION, IF NOT OUTRIGHT VENGEANCE. Let us not equivocate on that. And if the simple sanction for justice of “an eye for an eye” were to be imposed on rapists, I would go along with CASTRATION…but only after these “madderpackers” are pilloried (in Plaza Miranda)…hanged by their balls…until they can whistle the Pilipino National Anthem…in falcetto.
Let’s shift FOCUS, on the crime, how to deal with the crime. Once we have agreed on this, it wouldn’t matter who raped who, when, and where or how many times…the victim was raped, “pero hindi naman nilabasan (daw)….anong hindi, kitang-kita nga yung kumot, basang-basa, may dugo pa, paano, baka *donselya* or may period…okey, all of the above, tama ka…siya…4gib, at 4get na lang kasi ang totoo, nagkomplain ang mga rapist…HINDI RAW SILA NASARAPAN…ano ang say mo ngayon?” Damn!
“Nothing is properly seen, except in the totality (of scheme of things) to which it belongs. “I can see the trees…and I know the kind of trees they are…from the roots to the branches and last leaf…BUT I CANNOT SEE THE FOREST, that people are always referring to. How is this incident (isolated?)- related to 40 million Pilipinos struggling to survive (even) below the embedded-endemic, incidence (level) of poverty?
Whew! I can’t believe I am writing all of this.
Pepeton
I just got an immediate response to my posting in . blog, here, but who for understandable reason, wishes not to be identified.
“Hoy Pepeton…naloloka ka na ba? ANG HINDI NASARAPAN AY YUNG NA-RAPE, yung GINAHASA ng mga walanghiyang, kampon ni Satanas, at pitong demonyong kuba…KAYA NABISTO ANG PANGRE-RAPE NILA…HINDI SILA MARUNONG MAKIPAGTALIK…AT MAGROMANSA…hayup sila. Kaya sinumbong sila…BISTADO!!! wawawahhhhh….Malaki, pero malambot….wawawahhhhhh
Ano naman yung umaalingaw-ngaw na balita…na FRAME UP daw lahat yan…pulitika daw lang, dahil, ang mga against sa VFA…humahanap ng pambatikus…? PATI MGA LIBERAL-MINDED AMERICANS daw…ayaw naman ng VFA, dahil sawang-sawa na ang mga Kano, sa patutsada ng mga ASIANO! All they want is DOLLARS. Nabasa ko ang banat mo ukol kay Andy Rooney…” Maaring tama siya…pero HATE KO ANG MGA GANYANG TAO. RIGHT MASYADO….was da matter wrong kung dolyars lang ang habol ng isang tao? so what?
Teka nga, KANO KA BA…ano yung mga diga mong “para kang archer kung umasinta”…????ano, indian pana, kakana-kana…walang itlog, pero ano ang kumakalog???” wawawahhhhh.
“bitayin….bitayin….pero, tama ka rin, bayagan muna….arrrrray ko puuuu….!” (end of response quoted verbatim)
——-
Pepeton
Dear Ellen,
My apologies if the following missive would seem “deplorable” to you but believe there is a need for a tit-for-tat.
Re: E-mail from Don Winters: “Pretty hard to rape a prostitute.Just another way of extortion. $500 and a visa to the U.S. will probably settle the case.”
Let’s cut to the chase. Here’s what I propose Don Winters. I will personally help those 5 American rapists get off the hook but in exchange, Don Winters should agree to be taken to one of those clubs in Malate populated by bakla prostitutes to be ‘ravished’ (ok, raped) by a group of bakla prostitutes.
If that is not acceptable to him, I am prepared to pay for his return fare to either London, Paris, Madrid or even to boring Frankfurt in Europe, or even to Cité Saint Denis outside Paris just so he honors the commitment – get ravished, er, raped by 5 baklas in any of those cities (he will be met at any of those cities’ airports by Algerian friends of mine when he arrives).
It should cost me a little more than 10 times what Don Winters can afford to spend on his prostitutes but hey, I can very well afford it and boy, it would be worth the friggin show. After all $500 is only 300 Euros which is what I would pay a good American maid’s day wage (my maid is American).
Undoubtedly, Don Winters will agree that such selfless act of patriotism (to save his US rapists-compatriots) on his part will go well towards a win-win situation between US of A and RP.
Regards.
To Manuel Buencamino:
Ugly Americans like Don Winters should just go back to the cave where they belong. You paid $10 each for his mother and sister?? Now that’s extortion! I paid only $3.50 for each of them, plus another $2 for his wife.
It’s tragic. but why don’t we also get this excited about rape and incest when it’s Filipino on Filipino? Why does the issue involve int’l politics. Would there be fewer such incidents if we had no VFA? What about tourism, should the Left not also demand an abrogation of foreign tourism BECAUSE many foreign tourists do indeed rape our women? Is it because they are soldiers?
Ellen,
If you’ll pay for the lunch, tell your friend I have the drinks covered.
Re: Rizalist Says:
November 8th, 2005 at 7:48 pm
It’s tragic. but why don’t we also get this excited about rape and incest when it’s Filipino on Filipino?
Dear Rizalist,
I think you’ll find that is precisely what happens – if you have been reading the news, you will notice that Filipino rapists and incest criminals are sentenced either to prison for life or for lethal injections.
There’s no double standard kind of thing here. Don’t get excited about the American suspects getting a raw deal. Relax!
Cheers.
Este, Rizalist, I am with you there. For reasons already stated, the bloviators and spinners and PR propagandists view this incident as an opportunity to politicize, dichotomize and aggrandize themselves.
A crime has been alleged to have been committed. That is all that is known at this point.
RAPE is a serious-heinous crime. Regardless where. Regardless who. We all agree on that also.
But other than the uncorroborated reports in the “news”, there is really very few facts known (and proven) about the circumstances of the crime.
In fairness, therefore, prudence dictates that self-respecting (and law-abiding) individuals ought to refrain from making any kind of value judgements about the culpability of anybody involved, i.e., be it the accused; or the alleged victim of the hideous act. Vigilance should be guided and tempered by objective (and honest) discernment.
Ms. Anna de Brux avers that “…if you have been reading the news, you will notice that Filipino rapists and incest criminals are sentenced either to prison for life or for lethal injections.”
* * * Will Ms. Brux oblige this forum with some statistics or examples of this assertion?
(In the Philippines, how many individuals charged with rape, actually end up in jail to serve their sentence?)
There have been a number of (celebrated)cases involving pedophile crimes (i.e., tantamount to statutory rape)throughout the Philippines. How were these adjudicated?
Ms Brux concludes with: “There’s no double standard kind of thing here.”
* * *This is a gratuitous statement; it begs the question: “Will the USA military personnel be given a fair trial in the Philippines?”
(The acid test for this lies in the answer to the question: “Does the (ordinary) Pilipino get a fair trial in his own country?”)
This is a serious concern by the Americans. And should be, just as serious a concern among Pilipinos. And like it or not, the investigative process and judicial system operating in the Philippines are not exactly the paradigms of equality and impartiality. Believe that. Accept it. The unfavorable reputation and deficiencies of our “system of justice” is a well-known fact.
If this incident had happened in a country like Singapore, would the USA be as concerned (i.e., or take a similar they are now manifesting in this case?).
Probably, yes. But that’s because the USA is solemnly pledged to protect their citizens, wherever they are.
Who remembers the case of a young American who was jailed in Singapore (and was whipped as part of the punishment)- for some mundane reason (vandalism?)? Did the USA raise a stink about it? The USA government DID NOT. The USA media did.
================
“Don’t believe everything you hear(read). And only half of what you see.”
This “incident” has not begun to unfold yet.
Pepeton
Here are some “legal viewpoints” which are pertinent to the case, from our resident Legal Counsel, based in the East Coast, USA, Mr. Tony Figueroa.
————————
— PusongPinoye2@aol.com wrote:
> Tony F…can you give us some ‘legal insights” into
> this incident of 6
> military men from the USA RAPING A PILIPINA? What
> has the VFA treaty agreement
> really got to do with the “conduct and behaviour” of
> USA armed forces enlisted
> men?
>
> How is this agreement impacted by the “extradition
> treaty”? By the “mutual
> legal assistance treaty?
>
> And good stuff like that.
>
> Pepeton
The response of Tony F., follows:
========================
“I am not familiar with the provisions of the VFA.
What I know from press reports is that there is a
provision in the agreement that gives local (i.e.,
Philippine) authorities jurisdiction over cases
involving “heinous” crimes committed by foreign
(American) military personnel. Rape, apparently, is
considered a heinous crime and the obvious implication
is that the alleged rape would therefore fall within
this provision.”
“I don’t think that there is any dispute as far as the
application of this provision is concerned. Both the
US and Philippine governments, I believe, agree that
the Philippines has jurisdiction. What is being
questioned is why the accused US servicemen were in US
custody rather than in the Philippine authorities.”
“From where I sit, that looks more like a political
question rather than a legal one. By taking custody
of the accused, is the US government saying they could
not trust Philippine authorities of respecting their
rights? We don’t really know if this is the
motivation but it does come to mind if we consider the
reputation (rightly or wrongly) of the PNP in handling
detainees or even the Philippine judicial system in
administering justice. There is also all that noise
being written up about US withdrawing support for GMA
and of her sending Romulo to the US to explore exit
strategies, etc.”
“Whether the US is justified under the terms of the VFA
in taking custody of the accused is again something
that only the provisions of that agreement will show.
If the agreement does not allow the US to do that,
there is a serious question about why the local
authorities did not insist on having custody. If the
VFA allows the US to gain custody, I’m sure activist
elements will question why the Philippines agreed to
such at the expense of diluting Philippine
jurisdiction in such cases.”
“By the way, whatever happened to the question of
whether the VFA is a valid agreement. The question
was posed based on the fact that it was never ratified
by the Senate (I don’t know which, US or Philippine or
both). Apparently there was a constitutional issue
involved, i.e., foreign military forces are not
supposed to be allowed on Philippine territory without
a valid treaty. (Is this the issue?) The question of
whether there is a valid treaty becomes extremely
relevant.”
Tony F.
The Philippines ratified the VFA .(FVR wanted the Senate to get into the picture, probably to share the responsibility in case anyting untoward like this happens but he was not sure if he could swing it for ratification during his term. So, he didn’t risk it. It was in the second year of the Estrada administration, who was then popular, that it was ratified.)
The U.S., however, considered it an executive agreement and didn’t submit to their Senate for ratification.
They say despite that, VFA is valid.
Last night, in Pia Hontiveros Strictly Politics, Foreign Undersecretary Zosimo Jesus Paredes, executive director of the VFA commission, made a distinction between “jurisdiction” and “custody”. He said the Philippines has “jurisdiction” on the case because the VFA states that “Philippine authorities shall have jurisdiction over United States personnel with respect to offenses committed within the Philippines and punishable under the law of the Philippines.”
However, he said, the U.S. has custody over the suspects because the VFA also provides that “The custody of any United States personnel on whom the Philippines is to exercise jurisdiction shall immediately reside with United States military authorities, if they so request, from the commission of the offense until completion of all juidicial proceedings.”
He said, “We have jurisdiction, they have the custody.”
I’m trying to understand it. What is jurisdiction if we don’t have custody?
Hi Ellen,
Re: “He said, “We have jurisdiction, they have the custody.”
I’m trying to understand it. What is jurisdiction if we don’t have custody?”
Try asking Tony Carpio; he almost single-handedly advised FVR on the VFA.
Anyway, in the long run, if the US military decides that there’s no merit to the case, the Philippines claim over jurisdiction will just be ONE BIG JOKE. I am quite certain, the US Embassy will not waive its custody rights.
This was what I meant in my earlier postings when I said the Philippines will never be able to prosecute the accused, etc.
If the real concern is to obtain justice for the poor victim, the better tactic is for RP to agree to a US court martial but held in the Philippines. Obvioulsy, the terms for such an agreement must be ironed out. My fear is that if the people (as in ‘The People of the Philippines vs. etc.) allow DOJ “chief” Gonzales to handle the negotiations, he might sell out, i.e., bungle the whole thing.
Cheers.
P.S.: Btw, political pundits, observers, etc. allege that Carpio was the one SC member who shamelessly, publicly “negotiated” his entry to the SC by attacking the US Lockheed-Martin contract as null and void only to back out… I wish the guy would sue me if he has the balls so I could counter sue him and his U.S. & Philippine “friends” involved in the deal before the European Union!
Pepeton,
I will not go into specifics with you because I don’t know what you want to achieve.
Debating and arguing about the imperfections of the legal system in the Philippines and rape or incest statstics in the country will only make Rizalist get all the more EXCITED and from the looks of it, you too. The issue we are tackling here is justice for the rape victim, not you, not Rizalist nor anyone here for that matter.
Cheers.
Rape is a serious crime and those that are guilty of that crime ay kailangang maparusahan. But, like all crimes in the Philippines, the accused are presumed guilty (dapat, presumed innocent), kaagad, by the “law,” the press, and the masses kaya kapag ikaw ay naakusahan ng isang paglabag sa batas, tapos ka na. Dahil sa ganitong treatment sa mga akusado, laganap sa atin ang pandidelihensya sa mga turista ng mga sindikatong mey kasabwat na pulis o pulis-pulisan. Ganito ang modus operadi: Ang isang “prosti” ay sasama sa motel at doon sa motel ay kunwa mey raid, kung saan aarte ang babae na ni-rape. Karaniwan ay mey planted pa na druga. In the end, aareglo ang turista para hindi mapahamak. Easy money. This is usually very effective kung middle-aged or older ang turista-biktima. Try this one on the younger turista or a young “visiting” soldier, 90% of the time, hindi oobra ang delihensyang ito.
Is it possible na this is just a “botched up” na delihensya? Nagtatanong lang po.
Atong
Re Atong’s “Is it possible na this is just a “botched up” na delihensya? Nagtatanong lang po. ”
Probably yes or probably not. I suggest you ask the girl. Anyway, everyone can continue speculating but one thing I’m certain of, the girl’s now caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. So, on with the investigation, folks…
Ms de Brux argues her points (?) passionately (albeit inconsistently).
Atong Kuliglig (ay lab dat pseudonym), what you have described is “reality”! It has happened. Still does. You are RIGHT ON. It is not, as Ms de Brux,suggests “a probable speculation.”
In French we say – “Mademoisselle, Karumal-dumal na kababalaghan, mon cherie…ngunit, totoo tulad ng tato sa iyong ulo…nakikita lang pag ikaw ay nagpakalbo.”
Is it possible/probable that this “rape incident” will turn up a “botched up dilihensya”? Yes it is. Of course. Here is one intriguing aspect of the incident as it has been brought to “light”. Examine and review the facts that have been publicized thus far. SCANT! Why?
Maybe, just maybe, the (legal and/or media)) script is not finished, yet. This may be a prosecutor’s “legal strategy”. The accused are not talking either. Part of a defense legal strategy, too. Meanwhile, media continues to publish “bits and pieces” of potentially sensational “anecdotal versions” as to what really happened. Why? Because that’s all they know! And that is media’s profession…”to know and tell.”
Ms de Brux’ solution to this quandary is to “ask the girl”!!!???? Why single out, just the girl. Why not ask the accused also…??? Oversight? Prejudice? Automatic, impulsive-compulsive reaction to a situation?
That is the specific danger that I write about. Obstruction of justice comes in many forms. Guile (dishonesty) for one. Obstinacy for another. And, ignorance for a “probable cause”.
Proceed with the “details” surrounding the incident. Lately, the media has been adding bits and pieces about “the girl”. She is 22 year old COLLEGE GIRL…COMES FROM A GOOD FAMILY FROM ZAMBOANGA (DE BUENA FAMILIA, IKA NGA). What has this got to do with the incident? NOTHING! It just suggests that – HINDI BASTA-BASTA ANG RINAPE NG MGA HINAYUPAK NA US MILITARING HALIMAW…(ESTE, HALIMAWS PALA).
What would be the next (anecdotal) “scene”? Something about the RAPISTS…Let’s hear it.
Now go back to the “story”…i.e., “the girl accompanied a friend or relative on a ‘blind date’…then, while in the van…ginahasa…AT THE BACK of the Pilipino driver!!!”
And while the “eye witness” (puede bang eye witness kung nakatalikod ka???)signed a testimony, there is continuous attempt to confuse what the fact is…does he want to recant or does he not want to recant…DON’T ASK ANY POLITICIANS, Ms. de Brux.”
Just imagine and visualize it. Anim na malalaking Kano, nigagahasa…as in gina-“gang bang” yung “girl”. Anong girl?
At 22 or 23 years old – WOMAN na yun. Why do all accounts in the news talk about “the girl”? Even Ms. de Brux refers to her as “the girl”. A 22 or 23 year old “girl”, picture that! “Naku napakinosente noong bata…winalanghiya ng mga madderpacker na kano…”
Let’s stay in focus here. Just the facts. And only the facts. And a fact is – anything that “is” (philosophically speaking); or anything that happens, as in “pinuwersa ba the woman?” BTW, how come the “friend or relative” who invited her is “noncommunicado?” Where was she when the alleged raping was going? Lastly, every report I have read refers to SIX OF THEM…but in fact, there is also reports saying ONLY FIVE OF THEM were in the van. And that the SIXTH one was “released” after he said “I was not inside the van with the others.”
There is only one thing sure here. The impassioned defenders of the victim…”the woman” are emotionally attached to the “incident”…and if this had happened in the USA…I know some posters here will be “automatically disqualified” from serving as a “juror”…”Prospective Juror No.1 is prejudicial, your honor…she/he is so full of WHAT IS RIGHT…SHE/HE DON’T KNOW NOTHING ABOUT WHAT IS GOOD. I move for his/her DISMISSAL.”
Granted!
Pepeton
Pepeton,
What are you really trying to say?
My major concern is for the victim to obtain justice. I think I’ve made that very, very clear.
I therefore have no qualms about doing a tit-for-tat when someone advances that some rape complainants cry rape as a cover for extorting money. My instant reply will always be “If you really want to be sure, ask the victim herself.”
Does that worry you? My reply to Atong does NOT exclude a thorough investigation.
Cheers.
Anna de Brux said, “FMF (Foreign Military Funding), destined for the Philippines would come by way of training, schooling, mercy missions but not in cash nor in hardware . . .”
No cash or military hardware means walang kurakot. . . is that baaaaaaaaaad?
Ang nakikita kong benefit ng VFA sa Pinas ay ang paglago ng ating red-light-district economy sa kasalukuyan at ang paglawak ng ating selections of movie/TV/Basketball stars in the future. . . is that goooooooood?
Supposed the victim was coaxed and coached into filing the case even if there was no rape. . . that would be bad!
Ipikyur natin ang nangyari. Haka-haka lang po ito: Ang laman-kapasidad ng van ay ang Driver,isang pasahero sa harap, tatlong pasahero sa middle part, at hanggang apat na pasahero sa back portion ng van. Kung walo lahat ang laman ng van, kasama ang driver at ang babae, these “rapists” must be contortionists para maka-rape.
Sabagay, sa definition ng rape ngayon (sa aking pagkaka-alam) ay hindi na kailangan ang “bulls eye” para maging rape. Kahit haging lang kung hindi pumapayag ang aggrieved individual, rape na rin yon. But like any other witness in a criminal case, the victim should also be investigated if she is telling the truth. Bakit po ang karamihan sa atin ay ay nasasa-isip na that the accused are guilty? Mabuti po ba ito?
Dito nga sa Amerika, kahit mey confession na ang salarin, ini-imbestigahan pa rin kung ang confession ay natutugma sa tunay na crime scenario, bago mahusgahan at masintensyahan ang accused. Ganoon pa man, meron pa ring palpak na mga convictions of innocent people.
Sa Pinas, the pursuit of real justice is as illusive as finding the exact location of a singing cicada (kuliglig). Prosecution in the media and public opinion are rampant and long. By the time the hearing is started, even the innocent will be convinced that he, himself, is guilty.
-o-o-0-o-o-
Kaya bago po tayo tuluyang mahibang
Sa usaping “rape” na pinag-uusapan;
Buksan po muna natin ang Bibliya ni Inang
At baka meyron tayong aral na matutunan.
Sa libro ni Mateo, tsapter numero sinko,
Bersikulong banggit ay, numero beynte otso,
Sa salang pakiki-apid pakinggan ninyo ito,
I-apply natin sa rape, at matututo po tayo.
“. . . ang sinumang tumingin nang may pagnanasa”
Sa sinumang babae sa bahay man o kalsada,
Ang sabi po nitong aklat , tulad nitong ating media,
Nakiapid ka na Katoto ko, walang duda’t sapantaha.
Itong aking bibig, isa-shut up ko muna
At baka mey masabi akong salitang balintuna,
Ingat ako pagkat baka ako mapasama
At tulad nitong isda ay mahuli sa bunganga.
Atong
Atong,
You think so? But what are you really trying to say?
Cheers.
What I am really trying to say is for us to “hold our horses” and not prejudge the accused until their guilt are proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law. Dala kasi ng silakbo ng ating damdamin on what looks like a serious criminal act by foreigners perpetrated sa ating kababayan, napadadala tayo sa hangin ng “lynch mob” mentality. If we are to live up to a reputation of being a civilized people, we must exercise restraint on our animal instinct to protect our kind. That is why ang timbangan ni Binibining Hustisya ay patas for both the accused and the accuser. Pero bakit kaya siya blindfolded?
Ah ewan!
Atong
Atong, gusto ko ang tula mo.
Based on the testimony of the driver, he had five US servicemen passengers, plus the girl, plus himself. So there were 7 in the van. It’s not clear yet what’s the role of the sixth US servicemen, who was not inside the van, but included in the complaint.
Pepeton asks: “In the Philippines, how many individuals charged with rape, actually end up in jail to serve their sentence.”
Marami po ang natsa-charge ng rape. Hindi natin alam kung ilan sa mga ito ang Framed-Up-Charge-Kotong types that are usually amenably settled out of court. Meyron naman natsa-charge ng rape for revenge. . . dahil galit ang babae sa humiwalay na asawa kinu-coach-an ang pamangkin o katulong na na-rape diumano ng lalaki. Meron din namang tunay na rape and incest cases.
Although the burden of proof, ayon sa batas natin, is on the accuser, dito sa atin sa Pinas, kung ikaw ang accused kailangang patunayan mo na wala kang sala dahil presumed guilty ka na. Ayon sa batas natin, you must be proven beyond reasonable doubt (ng walang duda’t sapantaha) bago mahusgahang “guilty,” pero sa atin sa Pinas, mukhang guilty ka lang, tapos ka na. Kaya kung abogado ka sa atin, ano ang magiging future mo?
-o-o-0-o-o-
Dyak en poy, hale hale hoy. . .
Mainit ang dugo na sa ugat ko’y dumadaloy
Kasi po itong kaibigan kong si Buknoy
Abugado na po ngayon sa bayan ng Kasoy.
Murder po ang kaso na kanyang hinawakan
Ang testigong Medico Legal, naroon sa upuan;
Mga tanong ni Buknoy ay atin pong pakinggan
Upang mabatid ang kanyang katalinuhan.
“Ilan na po ang patay na inyong nautopsiya,”
Tanong ni Buknoy sa testigo niya;
Tumikhim ang testigo at inayos ang kurbata,
“Ang aking mga na-autopsy lahat po ay patay na.”
“Sigurado po ba kayong patay na sila?”
Tanong balik ni Buknoy na may panunuya.
“Sigurado po,” ang sagot, “. . . siguradong talaga,
“Tinanggal ko na kasi ang utak sa mga ulo nila. . .”
“Kung wala na ba ang utak,” kay Buknoy na patuya,
“Sigurado ka nang ang tao ay patay na, ganoon ba?
“Sa tinuran mong iyan talagang sigurado ka
“At walang exception sa salitang ibinaba?”
“Meyron po palang exception,” utal-sagot ng testigo,
“Ang exception po ay marami, sasabihin ko sa inyo,
“Marami pa pong nabubuhay kahit walang utak sa ulo,
“Mga abugado po sila, sa korte at sa Senado.”
Nag-iinit lalo ang dugo ko Kabayan,
Kasi itong Buknoy na aking kaibigan,
Tumangos ang ilong niya at lalong yumabang,
Tatakbo pong Senador sa susunod na halalan.
Sa ipinukol kong bato, sana po ang tamaan
Ay hwag namang magagalit, joking joking lang naman
Itong aking pakulo at salitang binitiwan,
Mag-dyak en poy na lang tayo, sa halip na magbuntalan.
He he he. . .
Atong
Cute naman ang tula mo!
Hehehehehe…Magaling talaga si Atong Kuliglig….Kaya ako napasangkot sa usapan dito, ako ay nabighani ng kanyang batikus.
Keep it coming Atong K.
Pepeton
Atong,
Prejudge? What prejudge? Read my first entry again:
“The better tactic would be to require that the 5 accused face U.S. military court martial in the Philippines (this can be done) and if they are proven guilty, could serve their sentence in US military prisons (which can be very, very tough on their inmates). This is the only way for both nations to come to a win-win situation, sort of sign of good faith from both parties, so that the victim that is if she was truly raped would obtain justice.”
In the same manner that hopefully, we are not pre-judging the victim either, i.e., as prostitute!
Ms Anna de Brux,
You seem to struggle with a lot of difficulty – trying to understand – any posting that does not jibe with your preconceived notions of almost anything.
I read the posts of Atong Kuliglig. I understood. Even Ellen Tordesillas finds his postings “nice”. I find them informative and entertaining at the same time.
Your comment (and attempt to rebut) is preceded (always) with “What are you trying to say?” He said what he wanted to say. Now my turn: “What don’t you understand about what Atong said???”
In your response to one of my postings, you preceded it with a similar (same) question: “What are you trying to say, Pepeton”?
I must reiterate, “What is it really that you don’t understand about the principle of innocence before guilt?”
You write like, you sound like, or are trying to give the impression that you are “wired to, connected with”, or something like that with the Philippine government. Did you not claim – in connection with the VFA that you told them so? (President Ejercito), during the deliberations of the VFA, there would be no cash? So, would you like to share that “privilege” here with the ET bloggers…exactly, in what capacity did you TELL the ousted president…”I told you so”???? Are you, or were you officially connected with the government in any capacity, particularly, with the deliberatons of the VFA agreement????
BTW, do you remember which came first? The terrorist attack on 9/11 or the signing of the VFA agreement?
Pepeton
No, Pepeton – I don’t think I will grant you that privilege!
I am prepared to tell Ellen everything and anything I know (Ellen has published a number of my letters in her column to her these last 4 years or so.)
As to being wired, connected, etc., you may believe or disbelieve what I said in my earlier posting – your prerogative. If it would help you understand why I am not inclined to grant your request, let me say in all simplicity that I am not enamoured of Americans when it comes to their relationship with the Philippines. My perception is that we are not on the same wavelength – that you are staunchly pro-American while I am not. Don’t get me wrong though! I believe everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion and that you are doing a good job airing yours.
Noblesse oblige! When you first posted what you referred to as ‘tit for tat’, in a somewhat “apologetic tone” I was inclined to jump in immediately to advise you: In the internet, as elsewhere, one’s contrary view need not be premised with an apology. And I was really about to encourage you to just FIRE AWAY, WHEN READY.
It is everyone’s RIGHT (and prerogative) to state a dissenting opinion or viewpoint. We both agree on that. We can disagree, as we do, without being disagreeable. That is why we are able to continue as I hope we will, this dialogue. Every encounter provides an opportunity towards a learning experience…provided both minds are open…receptive.
I am, enough to help guide your perception about my being staunchly “Pro-American” and see how we can meld this with your (qualified) admission that you are “Pro-Pilipino” (i.e., meaning you are NOT PRO AMERICAN – I don’t know if you mean that staunchly or emphatically).
But here is where the line is drawn. I know that Americanism (way of life of Americans) is based on the philosophy of “What is practical, useful, valuable” (Philosophy of Pragmatism). The American life(style) is based on the principle of (democratic) UTILITARIANISM – “Whatever is good for the Americans…i.e., the greatest good for the greatest number (of Americans – including naturalized citizens) – and the LEAST PAIN, for everybody else (throughout and all over the world)!”
To understand and appreciate the profile, posture and positioning of the USA’s foreign affairs policies and practices, one need to understand (better still, live the tenets of pragmatism (practicality), as it is reinforced in the philosophy of (democratic) utilitarianism.
This “lifestyle” (art of living, and practice of earning a livelihood)is, somewhat, almost-always in conflict or diametrically opposed with – what has long been advocated and manifested in the Philippines…primarily, I strongly suspect, because of the Pilipinos’ religious indoctrination.
Simply put, under a utilitarian principle – “A nation has no soul or conscience, to protect…only (pecuniary or estimable) resources and interests, to conserve, defend and allocate!”
However, the Philippines – its “governors” (include all political leaders) and its society deign to advocate…that “its nation has a soul and conscience…that the country has a profound sense of moral obligation…that it must uphold and adhere to…and profess, advertise, and promote…KASI KRISTIANO TAYO…”
The Americans did not pretend…to be a “nation of conscience and moral sense” when they were building it up. They did not use their TIME RESOURCES to pontificate on moral values…They just worked towards specific estimable and quantifiable goals…as a nation of individuals who pretty much pursued the dictates of their conscience individually, and in a CONFINED setting…i.e, private and personal.
Whereas, the Philippines and the Pilipinos took the other approach (still does) of manifesting outwardly – a “higher sense of ideals, etc…” Result? All the feigning, fawning, frothing has led to continuous degeneration of morality, in governance. Thee is a lesson taught here. IT DOES NOT WORK. This lifestyle does not work!
The American lifestyle works. So, the pragmatic approach to solving the problem of underdevelopment is TO COPY A SUCCESSFUL APPROACH. And apply whatever can be copied and applied.
==================
In that sense, yes, I advocate the American lifestyle. In that sense, too, I deplore the patronizing and hypocritical recommendation or allusion to – feigned nationalism and patriotism, and Pilipinism.
===================
The economic problems in the Philippines cannot and will not be solved through POLITICS. They are not part of the solution. Therefore, they are the problems. Therefore, too, those who advocate any kind of “politicization”(sic-Ople)as a solution, whether for or against the current administration, I declare is simply “full of it” for self-aggrandizement.
==================
The Americans are NOT ugly. They are PRACTICAL. Oftentimes the PRACTICAL things in life…expose UGLINESS. Since they are staunch proponents of PRACTICALITY, the impression (perception) stuck.
====================
Since you are “not enamoured of Americans when it comes to their relationship with the Philippines,” I will let you have the last word, on WHAT YOU THINK IS THE PROFILE AND IMAGE OF THE PILIPINOS AND THE PHILIPPINES TO THE WORLD OUTSIDE OF THE PHILIPPINES.
And when you do…I would appreciate it if you can cite readily and openly – HONESTLY and STRAIGHTFORWARDLY – your source and bases for disenchantment about “how the Americans have interfaced with the Philippines and the Pilipinos.”
I bow to your last words.
Pepeton
Pepeton, Pepeton, bow ako sa iyo,
Sa paghahanay mo ng mga falsies at totoo;
Ingles man o Tagalog, legalese o bugaloo
Magandang pakinggan, napapasayaw ako.
Katulad mo Pepeton ako’y napatapon
Dito sa Tate noong milnwebesyentos kopong-kopong
Ang kanila kasing opis na U.S. imigrasyon
Tinanggap ako kahit wala akong dunong.
Kaiba ka, Pepeton pagkat ikaw ay pantas
Baligtarin man ang baligtad kaya mong ibalangkas;
Katuwirang hunghang kapag iyong napitas,
Mabilis pa sa alas-kwatro sila’y takbo-karipas.
Dito sa Amerika ay aking natutunan
Ang maging mahinahon sa pangangatwiran;
Ang debate kasi, aking na-alaman,
Di pala nakukuha sa boses-palakasan.
Mga ugaling Pinoy ay dala ko pa rin,
Pamana ng ninuno ko na sa Iloilo nanggaling,
Kapag di ka makuha sa salitang mahinhin,
Kwidaw pagkat ikaw ay aming kukulamin.
Joking aside, Pepeton, Pepeton
Kahit ako pangit ay di ako pikon;
Mabait ako pagkat ako ay isang mason. . .
Masonorin, eka nga, ganoon, ganoon.
Pero ano ang message nitong aking tula?
Heto ang answer Anna de Brux na maganda:
“Ang hindi magmahal sa sariling isda. . .
“Mag-uulam ng paksiw na lasang bilasa.”
Ooops. Malayo yata yon, ah. . . .
Atong
Ha! Ha!Ha!
Atong taga Iloilo ka pala. I’m from Antique, katabi lang ng Iloilo.
Ellen,
My great-great-great grandfather is from the Iloilo-Antique-Aklan area. Never been there. . . not even Boracay. I might go there next year but I’m scared to go alone.
Atong
You know what really sucks is when you are dating a marine and get on the internet to show your mom, little brother, and grandma a picture of him doing his job and find out he and 5 other marines are accused of rape….no fun for anyone…
Is the marine you are dating one the five accused in the Subic rape case? Did he tell you what really happened?
Yea he is one of the accused in the Subic rape case, we haven’t talked since I found out…
It must be very hard for you.Are you a Filipina?
No I am an American…we were dating before he went became a Marine, then we stopped dating. After awhile we started talking again and decided we still liked each other. We thought it would be nice if we got back together after he came back home in August 2006, but don’t know what’s going to happen now…
Pray that the truth will come out. If he is innocent of complicity in the reported rape, he should be freed.
http://www.gmail.com